That’s the most important thing to remember about all this. They know he’s an abuser. They know he brags about it. They know all the despicable things he’s done.
And it’s either unimportant to them, or they’ve managed to become so psychologically twisted that they actually like it.
We have a society being dominated by deeply, deeply broken people right now.
This is a common problem all over the place. We don’t care what people we like do, and it’s not limited to Trump/Republicans.
R Kelly was a known pedophile for years, and still a celebrated musician until he finally went to jail. Ray Lewis killed a guy, but was on the Raven’s sideline as an honored guest and former player. Ellen Degeneres fostered a toxic work environment for year while hosting a popular talk show. Weinstein raped women for years while being a celebrated producer. Chris Brown has been beating women for years and still had success after many high profile incidents.
Chris Brown is wild to me. Many other cases are circumstantial-but-damning-because-frequency for a long time. Brown beat the fuck out of Rhianna, there’s police reports and photos of her in the public domain, and yet he still has a public celebrity that isn’t the “Chris Brown global apology tour”
I feel like Ellen caught a stray here, I’m not sure being a mean boss is equivalent to what Weinstein did.
I wasn’t trying to make an equivalent list, but she does feel out of place, but she did have a decade long talk show while being toxic behind the scenes. Chevy Chase was a known asshole before he left snl in comparison.
A lot of it boils down to abortion. When you see abortion as baby murder, it would take an awful lot to offset that moral significance. In other words, many who support Trump wouldn’t exactly condone rape, corruption, etc, but they feel abortion is a much larger moral issue.
Trump, who has 100% paid for multiple abortions to be performed.
No, it’s not about abortion. They are just bad people.
If that let’s you disengage from the issue, then OK. But, alas, reality is more nuanced than that.
Yep, no one is allowed to draw conclusions or to accept the truth about the people around them. They have to blindly do and believe what you tell them to, otherwise they’re unempathetic or otherwise bad people.
Miss us with that shit
WTF are you talking about? I’m sorry, I can’t parse what you’ve said as a response to what I said. I do, however, hear that you are very angry. I’m sorry for your frustration and hope you are able to figure out some positive way to channel that energy. I agree, there’s a lot going on in the world that is super-upsetting. I just don’t think we’ll solve anything by dehumanizing broad swathes of the population. Sure, some people are assholes and they’re certainly over-represented among Trump supporters. But, for example, the other dude who responded about his mother. Someone like her is not such a black-and-white case. And, generally, more is accomplished by trying to understand the motivations of others than by dismissing them as bad people.
Edit: But, yes, some people are bad (Trump, for example). And, it is not a good use of time to try to understand their motivations. I guess it comes down to how and where to draw that boundary of empathy, so-to-speak.
I see where you are coming from but I have direct experience with a decent number of these people, including my mother. She is kind, empathetic and generous but extremely fearful (not just of out-group humans - literally any unknown).
She has trouble understanding cause and effect despite being of reasonable intelligence and competence otherwise. She has been in conservative news circles for 40+ years. As you might expect, she is a straight-R voter for the single reason that she can’t risk the lives of pre birth fetuses.
She has an extremely short attention span and short term memory problems. Despite being willing to discuss issues, abortion is such a foundational topic to her worldview there is exactly no chance that she could change her understanding of abortion or Republican voting habits.
I’m sorry to break it to you, but if your mother is a trump supporter, she’s not a good person.
At this point you have to be mentally handicapped to not know the man is an absolute monster, and anyone who supports him is complicit in the monstrosities he commits.
A kind, empathetic person would never vote R.
I’m not claiming ‘morally good’ status for her and I personally avoid communicating with her any more than I absolutely have to. I just wanted to add perspective that may be useful for the discussion
Exactly as her preachers told her, I know what you mean. Funny enough, they seemed to neglect all the parts of the Bible that would provide context - e.g. verses saying how workers deserve their wages, how leaders should not accept bribes, and hold themselves to higher standards in other ways too, not just speak the words but truly show love to one another, which nowadays is dismissed by “that’s socialism!” (to give a crap about the poor).
And the biggest one of all: Christians are not to judge the world, but are to judge their own, in-group selection, with filtering rules in place. So e.g. if abortion was so bad, maybe excommunicate someone that got one, but don’t BAN it in the secular sense. Except they never bothered to do the former? If they truly meant it, then why act hypocritically, as Jesus commanded to be avoided at all costs btw, by allowing abortions in their own communities, but not in those “other” places? (performed by the poors) And likewise, why vote for rather than decry and remove Trump, or at least vote for him while also stating how what he did was BAD?
She TRUSTED her leaders to lead her correctly, and they let her down. The thing is, if she voted, then she also became a “leader”, and thus bears some responsibility. Perhaps truly responsible people should implement an IQ test or some such for voting, but as it is, she isn’t solely a victim. Which is one of the sadder parts of all of this. She just loves people, and tried to step up and help as best she could - the same as those who showed up on January 6 btw - and they made her complicit in their crimes against humanity. It’s becoming “brother against brother”, just like the Civil War and fight against actual slavery, all over again, with people in the vast middle ground caught up on either of the various sides, both of which are condoning literal genocide, but not equally bc one is advocating for it specifically here inside our borders.
Sorry if this is a bitter pill to swallow, but literally lives are on the line here, and based on your words I thought you might be receptive to wanting to know that. She’s a victim yes, but not only that, if her actions are leading to people’s literal, actual deaths.:-|
The basest crime here is how some fucking assholes in like 1953 realized they needed some way to protect their voting base from being logically annihilated any time issues are debated, and laid out the correct strategy to create a separate perception of reality via media control.
You can’t even try to discuss how “real Christians” should act because up is down and forward is backwards. It’s “tough love” to make kids go hungry, “protecting the family” to hate trans/queer folk. Given the common thread of short attention span, by the time you establish any sort of shared reality, attention span timer is up and you have to start over or give up.
People downplay that Access Hollywood tape, but he wasn’t joking. He was completely serious. In his mind, he could - and did – literally grab women’s pussies because he thought they’d just let him do it.
Here’s the thing, as an SA survivor, there are several natural reactions to situations like that – fight, flight, or freeze. In close quarters, you often can’t flee, and with a large attacker, you can’t always fight. Freezing is a very common response to sexual assault.
So all these years, when he says ‘they just let you do it’, he’s been describing how his victims freeze and pray it will just end soon. And yet his followers and the media has turned it into a joke.
I think I can speak for many SA survivors when I say that’s disgusting, appalling, and hurtful.
I don’t find it funny at all and have to say my faith in humanity was absolutely crushed (below rock bottom) when he wasn’t immediately cast out after the tape came out. My mother (in her 80s) was like “yeah, that’s what we’re dealing with, son”.
It’s not locker room talk, it’s rapist talk.
It’s not locker room talk, it’s rapist talk.
100%. Worse, he says ‘they’ let you do it. How many women has he done this to? Obviously more than E Jean. Looking at the hell she’s been put through since coming forward, it’s no wonder his other victims haven’t been willing to come forward.
Trump was a co-defendant along with Epstein in the rape case of a 13 year old girl who dropped the case when herself and her family were threatened with death.
He’s not just a rapist, but a serial rapist.
As a dude who’s been in plenty of locker rooms… it is indeed “rapist talk”. For sure, there’s bantering of all sorts (mostly about boobs and dumbshit)… but there ain’t nobody in there that’s proud to talk like that; Unless they actually mean it and than they sound like a creepy fucking rapist, and nobody’s really having fun with the “jokes” anymore.
He’s a rapist. And by continuing to open his fat fucking mouth about how that’s “fine and whatever”, he brings down all men in the process. Fuck that dude, he ain’t allowed to be part of the “cool men’s club”, ya fucking weirdo. Fuck that dude
MAGA = Bad Humans.
You really are a shit person if you support this trash. No excuses, nothing can justify it, you’re just a piece of shit.
The worst part is how many women are in the MAGA movement. And they don’t care.
That’s the fun of the “it’s not a problem until it happens to me” crowd!
Internalized misogyny is real. When you’re absolutely brain dead stupid and have no personality, male validation is extremely powerful. You can get a ton of male validation by appealing to the dumbest ones who would drool at the chance to be in the same room as you.
After someone said “So, who cares? He’s the president” I decided to cut all contact and never speak to them again.
They know, they don’t care. The cruelty is always the point.
Because if they investigate him, they’d have to investigate all of them.
He was elected despite being on tape saying “grab em by the pussy, you can do anything”
They aren’t going to start caring about women suddenly. Women are just property to the base and they are expected to vote according to their owners. At least that’s what it looks like!
It’s not even that they don’t care; they actually like it, presumably because it legitimizes what they also already do.
We’ve understood this forever. What MAGA people all have in common is that they’re terrible people. It’s the seven deadly sins all rolled up into one voting block.
MAGA sees women as property. 2nd class citizens. Subhuman. They are to be possessed and done with as you please. The primary tenet of conservatism is that natural hierarchies exist. Conservatives believe men are inherently “better” than women. Period.
It’s a feature. Better, it’s a bonus. And to be clear it’s not limited to the conservative men, bc conservative women think this way too.
And when you’re a star, they let you do it. You can do anything. Grab 'em by the pussy. You can do anything.
THERE’S NEVER BEEN A SECRET TO THE PERSON HE IS. HE SAID IT OUT LOUD AND STILL BECAME PRESIDENT.
It’s not like people aren’t listening, it’s that those that vote for him actually think the same way and it makes them proud to hear it when it’s said
His fascist supporters love it, because it puts women “in their place” and they want to return to a time (not too long ago) when all of society swept abusive misogyny under the rug.
I mean, why else would they constantly demonize feminism?
It’s not really a surprise coming from the party of hate filled losers, incels and criminals. I expect no less and hope that voters remember come election time. It is long past due to send the Republicans back to under the rocks from which they came
Conservative morality isn’t based on the things it claims to be.
The foundations are these:
- Social hierarchy is natural and desirable.
- The hierarchy is asserted by selective rule-enforcement
- The game is zero-sum
They literally don’t believe that rules should bind high-status people; that’s what makes them powerful - and thus admirable - in their eyes.
Rules are only enforced downwards, protecting the strong from the actions of the weak - and violating that principle is the only sin.
That’s why they’re so hung up on race / gender / sexuality: those things are caste markers to them, and determine the right and proper role for people in their eyes. If someone steps out of their pre-ordained caste, that’s violating the hierarchy and eroding the rules that keep society ordered-therefore-safe, and therefore inherently immoral to them.
Every time people post another scoop on Trump getting away with shit, it just affirms his kingly, even godly status in their eyes.
The only thing that can bring him down is defeat and failure, being subjected to rules and forced to submit to them, showing him to be low-status and thus not admirable.
That’s why they’re so hung up on race / gender / sexuality: those things are caste markers to them, and determine the right and proper role for people in their eyes. If someone steps out of their pre-ordained caste, that’s violating the hierarchy and eroding the rules that keep society ordered-therefore-safe, and therefore inherently immoral to them.
You’ve nailed it. Also, if people start to realise these labels aren’t as fixed they may naturally extend those conclusions to other arbitrary markers - like class and wealth.
The book Fascism Today: What It Is and How to End It (excerpts) is fantastic to explain this new fascism and provides a very useful new definition: “Inequality through mythological and essentialized identity”
